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Westworld s01e09

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Tyler
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Sun Nov 27, 2016 9:36 pm

Confirmed! Confirmed! Confirmed!

I mean, MiB=William hasn't been confirmed, but i still have 20 minutes left. Multiple time frames is for sure a thing though.

Bernard Lowe and Arnold Weber. Reddit even predicted the last names so an anagram would work.
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Sun Nov 27, 2016 10:39 pm

I think we are seeing 4 time frames
35 years ago. Bots being built by Arnold/Ford. Bots are learning to dance in that town.
30 years ago. William/Dolores/Logan's story
1 year ago. MiB kills Mauve and her daughter
Present. MiB working with Teddy/Lawrence. Mauve breaking out. Bernard realizing he is a host. Dolores retracing her steps?
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Westworld s01e09

Postby itscsalvo » Mon Nov 28, 2016 8:40 am

Bernard Lowe and ARNOLD Weber, not Robert. It's crazy that reddit even figured that one out too.

Regarding time frames, I agree. And I think the show does a good job instantly switching timeframes seamlessly so we have a difficult time following. Two good examples of this: When Dolores was cut by Logan and ran away, in literally the next instant we don't see her in her wound. I feel like that was a jump to present day, where she's retracing her steps. Another example is less about timeframes, but more what we're viewing, and not when -- when Dolores was in the basement area talking to Arnold, except she was in her blue dress. He mentioned he couldn't help her, and I think we were viewing it from her memory, like she was imagining talking to Arnold. I don't know what part of the consciousness pyramid that is, but imagination seems pretty high up there.

Future state predictions:
  • William/Billy is going to kill Logan in the park, which will be the "incident"
  • William will run the company instead of Logan
  • Two things here: either William will buy out Delos and take over or he will invest heavily. Either way, he's a member of the board, which is known from ep 9.
  • Dolores is most definitely Wyatt, but I didn't think Teddy as as old of a model as Dolores?
Questions:
  • What about Dolores' dad, who got all of that information loaded up on him? I think that could be an Ep 10 thing, but I'm curious now.
  • WHAT ABOUT ELSIE?
  • Why didn't those hosts respond to Stubbs? Are they even hosts? Or do they only respond to Ford, like his bot family?
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:04 am

itscsalvo wrote:Source of the post Two things here: either William will buy out Delos and take over or he will invest heavily. Either way, he's a member of the board, which is known from ep 9.

It seems like MiB bought his place onto the board and by doing so saved Delos from going bankrupt.
itscsalvo wrote:Source of the post William/Billy is going to kill Logan in the park, which will be the "incident"

Probably, but don't you think a guest killing a guest is common? Like it could happen every once and awhile, but...maybe this is the first time it happened?
itscsalvo wrote:Source of the post Dolores is most definitely Wyatt, but I didn't think Teddy as as old of a model as Dolores?

So many theories on this and the maze. I think Wyatt is a retelling of Arnold's story and that story concludes with Dolores killing Arnold/Wyatt?

Another maze theory. Arnold originally created the maze for the sentient bots, but Ford is now using it to trap the self aware bots
itscsalvo wrote:Source of the post What about Dolores' dad, who got all of that information loaded up on him? I think that could be an Ep 10 thing, but I'm curious now.

Werd, must be an episode 10 thing. I was waiting for him to be shown when Bernard/Ford were in cold storage
itscsalvo wrote:Source of the post WHAT ABOUT ELSIE?

Bernard killed her...unless the writers are really trying to trick us
itscsalvo wrote:Source of the post Why didn't those hosts respond to Stubbs? Are they even hosts? Or do they only respond to Ford, like his bot family?

I think Ford set a trap for Stubbs. Stubbs was onto Bernard and Ford knows about everything happening at his park so he wanted to eliminate the risk.
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:05 am

I love how HBO does the penultimate episode in the season as the "omg holy shiat" one, it leaves the final episode to wrap things up a little.

Bernard = Ned Stark, but Bernard could always be brought back...

Does Ford know about Mauve? How could he not?
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Westworld s01e09

Postby tylersucks » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:28 am

Tyler wrote:Source of the post penultimate

I had to look this word up. you some kind of word smith?
Last edited by tylersucks on Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Westworld s01e09

Postby itscsalvo » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:28 am

Tyler wrote:Does Ford know about Mauve? How could he not?

Mauve was modified by someone with a much higher security clearance than Felix or Sylvester. Was it Bernarnold or Ford? Who else could it be? I think we'll find out in ep 10.



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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:37 am

tylersucks wrote:Source of the post I had to look this word up. you some kind of word smith?

It's as if I listen to a lot of TV podcasts and they use that word a lot.
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Postby bmyoungs » Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:17 pm

It was indeed a holy shit episode
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:07 am

Something I didn't notice but Reddit is debating, is Angela sentient? Angela is the host that greeted William in episode 2 and almost killed MiB this episode. The theory is that she isn't capable of killing Ford because of her good Samaritan reflex, but she knows how to get around that. She tied him to a horse and blindfolded the horse. She did this because the horse is a host and can't know that his actions will be killing a person.

The counter for this:
1) The timing is too perfect. The MiB had been tied up all night and morning, yet it's the exact moment that he wakes up and grabs the knife that an animal call triggers the horse to run off. In any other show, such a sequence would have been overly manufactured drama, but in Westworld, it strongly suggests its part of a programmed narrative to create a sense of danger for the guests.
2) The horse is also a host and is thus contains the prime directive not to seriously harm a human being. The hosts in the park can create a sense of danger, but always stops short of killing them. Chances are that if the MiB could not have escape in time, the horse would have stopped running. It's possible the rope is also a prop and is designed to snap loose at the right time, much like how the explosive cigars were activated from the control room.
3) Angela is part of Ford's narrative, as seen in this storyboard in episode 8 under "Act 2-Incident." I think this is further evidence for the theory that Ford's narrative take the meta route by making the hosts seem to gain sentience and control, yet are still bound by the rules (eg Bernard's interaction with Ford in episode 9).
4) Charlotte walks into the scene the second after the MiB cuts himself loose. That means she was probably watching the entire thing and walked in after the MiB had his little fun (she's wearing heels so she couldn't have been far off). If his life was ever in danger, she probably would have stepped in to intervene. It also shows the park techs are monitoring the situation, or how else could have she found him?
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Westworld s01e09

Postby itscsalvo » Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:29 am

Seems like an open and shut case here, boys. Thanks for the point/counter-point.

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Westworld s01e09

Postby Sarah » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:12 am

I don't think Elsie is dead, we saw Bernarnold choke her but never saw her die.

William seems to have the same knife as the MiB now...

I'm probably most invested in Maeve's story line at this point.
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Westworld s01e09

Postby tylersucks » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:15 am

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Postby Tyler » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:38 am

Sarah wrote:Source of the post I don't think Elsie is dead, we saw Bernarnold choke her but never saw her die.

I'm torn. We've seen 2 flashbacks with her and Bernarnold and both of them seem like she's dead. If she doesn't show up next week she's done.
Sarah wrote:William seems to have the same knife as the MiB now...

Good catch! I didn't notice that.
Sarah wrote:I'm probably most invested in Maeve's story line at this point.

Me too, but there is no way Ford isn't monitoring or even orchestrating it. He knows EVERYTHING about the park, of course he is aware of a bot being leveled up to 20 intelligence.
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Sarah » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:46 am

Tyler wrote:
Sarah wrote:Source of the post I don't think Elsie is dead, we saw Bernarnold choke her but never saw her die.

I'm torn. We've seen 2 flashbacks with her and Bernarnold and both of them seem like she's dead. If she doesn't show up next week she's done.


I'm thinking Bernard maybe has a similar fail safe to what we saw with Clem - can't kill someone if it truly conflicts with her code or something. Maybe he couldnt kill her. But yeah if she doesn't show up and blondie guy doesn't find her then she's dead.

Tyler wrote:
Sarah wrote:I'm probably most invested in Maeve's story line at this point.

Me too, but there is no way Ford isn't monitoring or even orchestrating it. He knows EVERYTHING about the park, of course he is aware of a bot being leveled up to 20 intelligence.


She's probably part of his new narrative.
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Westworld s01e09

Postby itscsalvo » Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:30 pm

Tyler wrote:
Sarah wrote:I'm probably most invested in Maeve's story line at this point.

Me too, but there is no way Ford isn't monitoring or even orchestrating it. He knows EVERYTHING about the park, of course he is aware of a bot being leveled up to 20 intelligence.


She's probably part of his new narrative.[/quote]
I'll be damned if this just didn't blow my mind. Thinking about it a bit further, we (the viewers) really have no idea the level of control that Ford does/doesn't have over the hosts and the park. It wouldn't shock me if prompting sentience and getting other sentient hosts to "break free" via the maze could occur. This rides on the coattails of the maze is orchestrated by Ford to capture sentient hosts.

Sarah wrote:Source of the post I don't think Elsie is dead, we saw Bernarnold choke her but never saw her die.

Also, I'm on Team Elsie isn't dead. Pretty much, if it's not directly shown in the show, I assume that it's false.
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Re: Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:29 pm

Werd to Sarah blowing our minds. Didn't even consider he wanted Meueveveve to happen because of the new story
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:21 am

I want my parents to watch this show and ask them after every episode if they have any idea what is going on.
Most of us here knew about the multiple time frame theories, but what if you didn't? If no one had mentioned that MiB could be an older version of William would you ever piece that together on your own? What would you have thought when Dolores was cut open and shown to be mechanical? I bet I wouldn't have thought "this must be 30 years in the past", I would have just assumed she looked like that because she was the oldest host in the park.
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Postby bmyoungs » Fri Dec 02, 2016 9:19 am

Tyler wrote:I want my parents to watch this show and ask them after every episode if they have any idea what is going on.
Most of us here knew about the multiple time frame theories, but what if you didn't? If no one had mentioned that MiB could be an older version of William would you ever piece that together on your own? What would you have thought when Dolores was cut open and shown to be mechanical? I bet I wouldn't have thought "this must be 30 years in the past", I would have just assumed she looked like that because she was the oldest host in the park.

This is the type of show that would have blown or minds 10 years ago. It's so easy to look up fan theories now and make sense of things. They did an amazing job with the story telling to blend the two timelines and that seems to have gotten lost a bit.

If I had not been on here or Reddit I would have picked up on the two timelines around episode 6/7 instead of after the 2nd. I would have not guessed Bernard being a host until right before it was revealed. There are a ton of subtle hints to these reveals, but those are easily missed by 90% of us. The internet charter brings those hints front and center.

As fun as it is to discuss the theories, I almost wish I could have watched with blinders and have all the holy fuck moments.
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Westworld s01e09

Postby Tyler » Fri Dec 02, 2016 9:37 am

bmyoungs wrote:Source of the post I would have picked up on the two timelines around episode 6/7 instead of after the 2nd

I have no faith in myself. I don't think I would have put it together until it was 100% spelled out...which still hasn't technically happened.

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